Curse

Improvavel · Jun 02, 2009, 01:45 AM // 01:45

I don't understand why when people are playing sabway they can just play a single n/rt but when they are playing discordway they need 2 necro/rt and ditch the curse necro.

Anyway, depending where you are and what henchies are available:

Discord resto - discord, foul feast, mb&s, spirit light, life, pwk, rez, sols (or optional).
Discord mm - discord, bone horror, bone fiend, death nova, sols, convert hexes, aegis, PS. Or animate bone minions and use the other slot for rez or shield of absorption or whatever.
Discord curses- discord, enfeebling blood, reckless haste, barbs, sols. Optionals - convert hexes, mop, weaken armor, rip enchantment, rez, remove hex.

Another option, if the monk henchmen are good (read not the faction twins) is to ditch the resto healer and replace it with a smiter monk like:

glyph of swiftness (at air 6), Roj, smite hex, strength of honor, heavens delight, castigation signet. Optionals include reverse damage, divine healing, smite condition, remove hex.

Neo Atomisk · Jun 02, 2009, 02:34 AM // 02:34

I rolled all but one map of eloba with sabway and h/h
i tried 2 man discord on that map, it failed. n
came back with 2 man necroway and i rolled it.
i reccomend sabway w/ dslash godmode.

racway is an alternative, though.

Axel Zinfandel · Jun 02, 2009, 05:33 AM // 05:33

I'd definitely recommend Racway for anything related to keeping SY! up.

getting through the game early, the easiest and earliest hero setup you can do is Rayway right now, which is pretty good to get you through the game

marmar256 · Jun 02, 2009, 06:11 AM // 06:11

Thanks for the current information and replies people. Axel i have finished the game already in all campaigns so i dont need to get the heroes and i have tried racway but i didnt find it as attractive compared to it being used on a para. I am currently trialing gigas builds and BenC777's builds. Anymore builds would be nice and any other comments will not go astray.
Thanks again and keep em coming. Also Daesu what hex removal, condition removal and ench removal do you recomend?

jayebyrd00 · Jul 01, 2009, 11:48 AM // 11:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghen

you tank + 3 SF heroes
corrected , now stfu

Go outside and play little one. Let adults are trying to talk.

Super Igor · Jul 01, 2009, 12:23 PM // 12:23

Discordway, you go as a caller just make sure to have a +20 energy staff.

marmar256 · Jul 01, 2009, 10:52 PM // 22:52

Yes Igor that has been told of me already, but i am a warrior not a caster. I thank you for your suggestion but if i wanted to have a staff id be a caster. I would prefer to use a sword, axe or hammer (scythes or daggers are ok). I have used staff discord before and sure it works but imo it is very boring. Thanks for the input though!

With the new updates of the rits and paras has anyone else had any new ideas?

Thanks and keep posting

Super Igor · Jul 02, 2009, 12:16 AM // 00:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by marmar256

Yes Igor that has been told of me already, but i am a warrior not a caster. I thank you for your suggestion but if i wanted to have a staff id be a caster. I would prefer to use a sword, axe or hammer (scythes or daggers are ok). I have used staff discord before and sure it works but imo it is very boring. Thanks for the input though!

With the new updates of the rits and paras has anyone else had any new ideas?

Thanks and keep posting

Have fun gimping yourself then, Discord is best PvE setup still and it works best with AP Caller so you must run it.

Dusk_ · Jul 02, 2009, 12:45 AM // 00:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Igor

Have fun gimping yourself then, Discord is best PvE setup still and it works best with AP Caller so you must run it.

Well, I'm sure you have plenty of fun gimping yourself with Discordway.

There are plenty of people who like their RPGs to be non-linear, thank you very much.

Gigashadow · Jul 02, 2009, 02:04 AM // 02:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by marmar256

With the new updates of the rits and paras has anyone else had any new ideas?

Here's what I'm running right now for vanquishing (not dungeons, I'm done with all those already); note, I'm not going to claim it's optimal, as I'm tweaking this as I go, but running the same old builds all the time makes me want to gouge my eyes out. Plus, I just love to experiment. Not at all heavy on defense, so kill fast.

Since both ritualists and paragons were updated, I figured, let's try out the new Signet of Spirits skill, plus two paragons. Normally I run minions, but figured let's try without, as minions just me slow down when vanquishing unless I bring an allies-wide speed buff.

There are several ideas contained in here:

Huge numbers of shouts triggering constantly from both paragons, plus "Save Yourselves!"
Plenty of interesting things (the 3 Finales) happen when a shout ends on someone
Uses 3 chants that also affect the 4 attacking spirits; +xx damage, interrupt, cause weakness
AOE burning from Blazing Finale
"They're on Fire!" reduces damage from burning foes
Weaken armor (AOE) + Chest thumper = spammable deep wound
No hexes; figured it wasn't worth adding just 1, it will get removed/shattered.

This is very weak against hexes that matter (insidious parasite, spiteful spirit), so add some hex removal for areas with those sorts of hexes that you MUST remove.

Purifying Finale will automatically remove conditions at a very high rate, given all the shouts. Song of Purification helps a decent amount also.

Anyways, this is just a starting point, it is not a long-term refined and optimized build like Sabway or Discord. I'm at the stage where I tweak a skill or two after vanquishing one area before I move on to the next.

Command paragon:

This guy gets 4 adrenaline per strike under Dark Fury (2 per strike when it's not up), which means "Go for the Eyes!" recharges in a single hit. He spams this, and it is great for his energy management as well. In addition to this, he attacks 25% faster.

Anthem of Envy/Weakness/Disruption affects the 4 spirits when they use their attack skill, as well as the 2 paragons and you. A nice bonus of Anthem of Envy is that if the foe was not at < 50% health, it does not consume the Anthem of Envy buff. So by the time you kill the first mob, you might have 7 entities with it ready to go, which takes a huge slice out of the next mob. This guy builds adrenaline so fast, Envy is up a lot.

Plenty of random interrupts from 7 entities able to trigger Anthem of Disruption.

13 spear
12 leadership
9 command

Focused Anger {elite}
Aggressive Refrain
Chest Thumper
"Never give up!"
"Go for the Eyes!"
Anthem of Weariness
Anthem of Disruption
Anthem of Envy

Motivation paragon

You will sometimes need to micro Blazing Finale onto yourself if he doesn't give it to you. It's really worth doing though.

12 leadership
12 motivation
11 spear

Song of Purification {elite}
Aggressive Refrain
Chest Thumper
Energizing Chorus (needed for energy management)
Blazing Finale
Purifying Finale
Finale of Restoration
"They're on Fire!"

Channeling N/Rt

Still tweaking this guy a lot; 12 curses seems like a waste, but if you make him a Rt/N he runs into energy problems. This guy spams the good channeling abilities, and doubles everyone's adrenaline gain with Dark Fury. Don't put Orders on this guy, it's a 2 second cast, too much health sacrificing, not worth it at all; you want him spamming weapon skills and putting Weaken Armor on the next target. Barbs also chews up too much casting time and things die too fast anyway.

Weaken armor is conveniently AOE, adds a litle bit of damage for you and the two paragons, and allows Chest Thumper to quickly proc a deep wound (which happens a lot). I find this preferable to putting Vicious Attack on there and hoping that "Go for the Eyes!" happened to be up just for that hit, although it's an acceptable alternative.

I was thinking about Defile Defenses to punish people for blocking, but it turns out that the AOE burning from Blazing Finale actually takes care of those annoying ranger mobs pretty well. That and I have Sun and Moon Slash that gets through blocking.

12 curses
10 channeling
10 soul reaping

Signet of Spirits {elite}
Bloodsong
Splinter Weapon
Nightmare Weapon
Rip Enchantment
Weaken Armor
Dark Fury
Signet of Lost Souls

There's also a different setup I also was running for a while, which is a little more conservative, and has a lot of AOE healing from the minions. Paragons were pretty similar to the above, but specced into a secondary, at the expense of spear mastery.

P/Mo Motivation Paragon, Strength of [email protected]
P/Rt Command Paragon, 10 channeling Splinter Weapon, 0 spear mastery
N/Mo Minion Bomber with Dwayna's Sorrow, Empathic Removal

Ghost Dog · Jul 02, 2009, 02:35 AM // 02:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

strength of honor

A warrior without the new SoH cast on it is missing out.

marmar256 · Jul 02, 2009, 03:15 AM // 03:15

Thanks for all the input guys and gals.

I like your set-up giga but i am still in the need for some dungeons but your set-up is great (you say) for vanquing but not dungeons. Therefore it will be useful when i am in the need for a vanq.

Igor: how is not wanting to weild a staff gimping myself? Also why is discord way so great or better than other set-ups?

Ghost dog i also like the new SoH for my war.

Thanks for the extra input and keep it all coming please.

Also i atm am running 3 necros. MM with empathetic removal and SoH, Nrt healer with splinter and a Rit hero with SoS.

Super Igor · Jul 02, 2009, 10:24 AM // 10:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by marmar256

Thanks for all the input guys and gals.

I like your set-up giga but i am still in the need for some dungeons but your set-up is great (you say) for vanquing but not dungeons. Therefore it will be useful when i am in the need for a vanq.

Igor: how is not wanting to weild a staff gimping myself? Also why is discord way so great or better than other set-ups?

Ghost dog i also like the new SoH for my war.

Thanks for the extra input and keep it all coming please.

Also i atm am running 3 necros. MM with empathetic removal and SoH, Nrt healer with splinter and a Rit hero with SoS.

Because when youre not wielding a staff chances are you wont have enough energy to call for Discord.

Discord is so great because it's versatile, safe and strolls shit faster than anything. By the time you get in range to hack stuff in melee I already killed the mob from max range. :P

Squishy ftw · Jul 02, 2009, 10:57 AM // 10:57

Why any selfrespecting warrior would wield a staff and run AP to call for his silly discord heroes is beyond me.

Discord works perfectly fine on a normal warrior, wielding hammer/axe/sword. Just make sure you have no problem spreading hexes/conditions, either through yourself or your heroes. As a warrior you'll probably be spreading the conditions easiest.

Super Igor · Jul 02, 2009, 11:24 AM // 11:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Squishy ftw

Why any selfrespecting warrior would wield a staff and run AP to call for his silly discord heroes is beyond me.

Discord works perfectly fine on a normal warrior, wielding hammer/axe/sword. Just make sure you have no problem spreading hexes/conditions, either through yourself or your heroes. As a warrior you'll probably be spreading the conditions easiest.

This shows you never played Discord like it should be played and stubornly defending a position for the sake of it.
Spreading conditions and hexes through heroes exclusively is slow, so are calls from melee range. Especially for warriors who either have to wait for long recharges or to build up adren.
You will also lack a very powerful caller spike and kd-lock which give Discord an absolute advantage vs. mobs with high damage or healbots.
I was thinking like that as well when AP Caller trend just started, "lol what self respecting sin would run this wierd thing over MS/DB??". When I first rolled Discordway with an AP caller this way of thinking quickly changed.

Last but not least FINE is not enough, it should be EXCELLENT or AWESOME and with AP caller Discordway is exactly that.

Squishy ftw · Jul 02, 2009, 11:56 AM // 11:56

It doesn't matters how much more awesome it is as long as it's a warrior wielding a staff. The OP doesn't want to run it like that and I really can't blame him for it.

I know that an AP caller with the 3 PvE skills will be better, I've run it myself plenty of times (not on warrior though) but it simply doesn't matters here as the OP wants to whack stuff.

Also, fine is good enough if awesome means not being able to run your prefered char the way you want it to.

upier · Jul 02, 2009, 12:53 PM // 12:53

The basic Disco chain is AP-YMLD!-EVAS-FH!
That's 35 energy.
After the foe dies, you gain back 17.
That leaves you 18 energy short. Given the fact that a warrior has 2 pips of e-regen, that means it takes some 30+ secs to regen the rest.
For Disco to work you NEED to cast AP and YMLD. And after the initial foe (or two) you'll pretty much just be doing that because you won't have the energy for anything else.
So the player, who has access to the most obscenely powerful skills in the game will use his skillbar to provide a hex, do up to 80 damage and cripple the foe.

So no, I wouldn't recommend an AP based Disco to a warrior. If Disco should be ran, I'd suggest looking into an WE guy with AS.
More damage and SY!

Super Igor · Jul 02, 2009, 01:51 PM // 13:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by upier

The basic Disco chain is AP-YMLD!-EVAS-FH!
That's 35 energy.
After the foe dies, you gain back 17.
That leaves you 18 energy short. Given the fact that a warrior has 2 pips of e-regen, that means it takes some 30+ secs to regen the rest.
For Disco to work you NEED to cast AP and YMLD. And after the initial foe (or two) you'll pretty much just be doing that because you won't have the energy for anything else.
So the player, who has access to the most obscenely powerful skills in the game will use his skillbar to provide a hex, do up to 80 damage and cripple the foe.

So no, I wouldn't recommend an AP based Disco to a warrior. If Disco should be ran, I'd suggest looking into an WE guy with AS.
More damage and SY!

Dont cast EVAS or FH! when youre energy is low, simple as that.
This disadvantage is made up by better spikes that they would otherwise be with normal warrior build.

upier · Jul 02, 2009, 02:12 PM // 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super Igor

Dont cast EVAS or FH! when youre energy is low, simple as that.
This disadvantage is made up by better spikes that they would otherwise be with normal warrior build.

The "disadvantage" in question is the fact that the warrior will be using 2 skills out of 8 for the majority of ALL fights.
I wouldn't call that "not gimping" yourself.

syphonus · Jul 02, 2009, 05:07 PM // 17:07

It's already gimped by the fact that it's doing the same job as N/A, but much worse. No one wants to play like that.